I'm wondering where this is going... or what it stemmed from, I suppose..
I had to put "I don't know" for a couple of them, because while as a woman I might worry about rape drugs if I were in a shady establishment, I don't know if my worrying scenarios would go all the way to pregnancy.
It stems from a discussion with Mikie in which ey was arguing that a woman getting herself pregnant without her partner's persmission is not as bad as rape and I was arguing that it can be just as bad if the victim objects to it equally much.
I'm not sure that the questions above can entirely get at that, without some other comparative questions thrown in. Or maybe you were just curious about some related issues.
Anyways, I answered that "a partner gets themself pregnant with your sperm against your wishes" is less awful than "a partner gets you pregnant against your wishes" because while the consensuality aspect is equally bad, I think overall the potential consequences for getting pregnant are worse than those of getting someone pregnant. In the latter case, at the very least there are the risks of pregnancy, the risks of abortion and/or the challenges of raising an (unplanned) child, and the potential of a deceptive SOB suing for visitation rights. In the former case, you might be forced into some financial entanglements related to the child...and that's about it.
However, I answered that "a stranger slips rape drugs into your drink and gets you pregnant against your wishes" is less awful than "a stranger slips rape drugs into your drink and gets themself pregnant with your sperm against your wishes and copies down your name and address from your wallet to sue you for child support." I think this one would vary more from person to person, and my answer is probably influenced by a male worldview bias among other things. I could definitely see it being equally awful or the latter being more awful, but since the question asks for me personally: (1) rape occurred in both instances, equally awful (2) pregnancy against my wishes occured, somewhat more awful in the former case regardless of what options I choose from there on out (2b/3) long-term consequences/reminders of the rape, somewhat more awful in the latter case due to the addition that one would definitely be sued for child support - but this answer is with the caveat of understanding that abortion is available and safe in my area, and that the courts would not be stupid enough to grant (or even allow pursuit of) visitation rights for a male rapist, and as you said earlier that the courts would not side with a male rape victim except under the most extreme circumstances...all of which may at this point in history be tenuous arguments, granted.
We both recognized that the questions didn't entirely get at that. We just ran out of patience for revising the questions together any further.
And definitely my answers depend completely on the availability of abortion. If I had no access to it, which many people don't, I would find it far worse to be made pregnant.
If the rape resullts in pregnancy, the result (an unwanted child or abortion) would be the same as if some woman got herself pregnant against the will of the partner, but the victim is the one having to suffer through pregnancy and labor or an abortion. If someone got themselves pregnant by me against my wishes, at least all that would be going on in their body, not mine. And I like kids, so I wouldn't be so horribly upset at the prospect of there being one of mine running around, although I might be upset that I didn't have custody (supposedly if the person is suing for child support, though, I'd have a decent chance of getting some sort of partial custody as long as I wasn't some really creepy person - especially since obviously the kid's mother is a "slut" who sleeps with men in bars and the court system tends to frown on such activities in mothers). The main issue I'd have is that my child is the child of a rapist, an issue that I'd also have had if I'd been raped and impregnated and decided to carry to term.
However, in the case of consenting partners and getting pregnant against one's will, I think it would suck more to be the guy in that situation, because if I got pregnant from sex that was consensual, I'd probably want to keep the child. If I were the male part of that coupling, though, I would have a lot more choices over what happens to the fetus/child. If I were a man I'd only want to get someone pregnant if I trusted the person I was with (in fact I'd probably want to be married to them) and we'd had a long discussion about what would go on during pregnancy, etc.
And no, I don't really worry all that much about sex partners getting me pregnant against my will in general. I'm on the pill, so there's not much that my partner can sabotage that would get me pregnant. Though I do worry enough about strangers with date rape drugs that I said "yes" to the second-to-last question.
This is a strange one. :) I wonder if my publically-viewable answers will count against me personally, with anyone?
With the standard disclaimer that any of these situations are hypothetical and a number of variables could change my answers. My reasoning behind the questions went something like this:
1. In all questions involving rape drugs, the rape part was a worse thing to me than the pregnancy part, and I see rape of myself-as-a-woman as "worse" than rape of myself-as-a-man (though both are bad.) I would get an abortion if I were a woman, and I suspect the courts would be on my side were I the man in that situation.
2. In all the "consensual" questions, worrying about intentional pregnancy was a small issue because sex would not be consensual for me unless it involved proper use of contraceptives and trust of my partner.
As usual, I would very much like to know some of the context behind this poll. :-)
I personally would not have any confidence at all that the courts would be on your side if that happened to you as a man, unless you happened to have gone directly from waking up from the drugs to the nearest police station and got your blood tested to prove there were rape drugs in your system, in which case you might have a fighting chance. But I base this only on my admittedly unproven presumption that the patriarchal bias in our legal system which puts female rape victims at a disadvantage would not benefit male rape victims by viewing them as men and therefore more believable, but would rather view the fact that they said they had been raped as grounds to consider them less than "real men" and take away any privileges of maleness from them.
In all the consensual questions, "consensual" indicates only that you were consenting to have sex because you had been told that no pregnancy would be involved, and when the pregnancy turned out to be involved, that was not consensual at all.
I have heard of a case rather similar to this happening (supposedly, it's not 100%). A couple were having sex at a college i was attending and, despite using condoms, pregnancy popped up. Well, the woman got child support out of the man and then later revealed that she had sabotoged the condoms which she had been providing. I wouldn't have much faith in the court's decisions on your scenario either...
As far as your question elsewhere about being raped and becoming pregnant yourself vs. being raped and impregnating followed by suing for child support: as far as i'm concerned, being impregnated is worse than someone impregnating themselves against your will, but rape is bad regardless and when you are using it as a means to essentially steal money from someone until the child support runs out that's pretty bad as well. One thing that must not be forgotten: the child in this case is merely a means to an end (money) and i suspect that there will be a severe lack of love and care in the child's life.
Child support is not normally enough to make a profit off of. It is normally less than the total cost of the child's upkeep, so I would assume that no woman would do this to a man for the sake of money unless maybe the man were a millionaire whose child support payments would be unusually high. If the man in question were a nonmillionaire then I would guess that the woman did it because she wanted children or because she wanted to tie this man's life to her own in some way, rather than because she wanted to make money.
"Child support is not normally enough to make a profit off of."
I think, however, it is safe to say that the people who are willing to intentionally impregnate themselves and then attempt to extract child support from someone they raped in the process aren't precisely rational.
Secondly, this is one of the reasons concern for the child is warranted...
If someone is trying to make a profit off having children i'm pretty sure some ignoring of the resulting child's basic human needs will take place.
As far as the one in question: again, the story is a bit hearsay- i don't know many of the details and have my own doubts as to the veracity of what i do know. However, the woman in question certainly fit the non-rational model- and that's from my interactions with her, not from hearsay.
I was thinking something along the same lines, which is why I assumed that the motivation would be primarily to have a child and secondly getting child support. So my reasoning in this question is that in both cases the sex and the pregnancy is non-consensual (one person wanting it, the other person not wanting it), and it would be better if the person who wanted sex/pregnancy/child would be the one to carry the child rather than the person who was drugged (both for the new parent and for the child). Child support didn't really factor so much into my equation because in comparison with raising a child, it's soooooooo much less of a burden.
1: a stranger slips rape drugs into your drink and gets you pregnant against your wishes I just think him then sueing me would be a bit idiotic because if I would discover I'd been raped, I'd go to the police long before there would be any babies.
2: a partner gets you pregnant against your wishes I can't imagine being a man, and having objections to someone using my sperm. But that is probably because I have the feeling the pregnancy is much much harder on the woman for those 9 months than for the man- he doesn't really feel the consequences, except if the woman expects any money for the baby.
3: no. I have never heard of a guy deliberately wanting to just impregnate a woman in that situation. Plus I'd be adamant of using protection.
4: no It really depends on the situation. See above, I can't imagine *minding* much if someone got pregnant off me. But then again, I'm not a man ;)
5: yes It's just something my parents taught me: always watch your drink, never leave it alone - or when you have to, just get a new one.
1: a stranger slips rape drugs into your drink and gets you pregnant against your wishes I just think him then sueing me would be a bit idiotic because if I would discover I'd been raped, I'd go to the police long before there would be any babies.
But then you'd be a man claiming he was raped. It's rather hard for men to prove they were raped, even harder than it is for women.
In the question that involves a person suing you for child support, you're supposed to imagine you're a man, and the rapist is a woman who intentionally got pregnant off of you.
I can imagine. Let me assure you, I'm not someone who trivialises someone elses pain, so I thought it was a strange question to ask in the first place. ;) Glad you told me and gave me the opportunity to clarify!
I think that as long as you're male, having sex with an equal number of males and females would bring at least as high a risk of people deliberately wanting to infect you with AIDS as of people deliberately wanting to force you into parenthood. Very few males actually encounter either situation. I grant, however, that if you somehow did encounter either situation, attempted pregnancy carries higher odds of success in a smaller number of attempts than transmitting the AIDS virus - even if we presume that the person trying to infect you with AIDS virus would indeed be infected with it themself, which is also a smaller subset of people than the number who could get pregnant.
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I had to put "I don't know" for a couple of them, because while as a woman I might worry about rape drugs if I were in a shady establishment, I don't know if my worrying scenarios would go all the way to pregnancy.
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Anyways, I answered that "a partner gets themself pregnant with your sperm against your wishes" is less awful than "a partner gets you pregnant against your wishes" because while the consensuality aspect is equally bad, I think overall the potential consequences for getting pregnant are worse than those of getting someone pregnant. In the latter case, at the very least there are the risks of pregnancy, the risks of abortion and/or the challenges of raising an (unplanned) child, and the potential of a deceptive SOB suing for visitation rights. In the former case, you might be forced into some financial entanglements related to the child...and that's about it.
However, I answered that "a stranger slips rape drugs into your drink and gets you pregnant against your wishes" is less awful than "a stranger slips rape drugs into your drink and gets themself pregnant with your sperm against your wishes and copies down your name and address from your wallet to sue you for child support." I think this one would vary more from person to person, and my answer is probably influenced by a male worldview bias among other things. I could definitely see it being equally awful or the latter being more awful, but since the question asks for me personally: (1) rape occurred in both instances, equally awful (2) pregnancy against my wishes occured, somewhat more awful in the former case regardless of what options I choose from there on out (2b/3) long-term consequences/reminders of the rape, somewhat more awful in the latter case due to the addition that one would definitely be sued for child support - but this answer is with the caveat of understanding that abortion is available and safe in my area, and that the courts would not be stupid enough to grant (or even allow pursuit of) visitation rights for a male rapist, and as you said earlier that the courts would not side with a male rape victim except under the most extreme circumstances...all of which may at this point in history be tenuous arguments, granted.
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And definitely my answers depend completely on the availability of abortion. If I had no access to it, which many people don't, I would find it far worse to be made pregnant.
I agree with Mikie
However, in the case of consenting partners and getting pregnant against one's will, I think it would suck more to be the guy in that situation, because if I got pregnant from sex that was consensual, I'd probably want to keep the child. If I were the male part of that coupling, though, I would have a lot more choices over what happens to the fetus/child. If I were a man I'd only want to get someone pregnant if I trusted the person I was with (in fact I'd probably want to be married to them) and we'd had a long discussion about what would go on during pregnancy, etc.
And no, I don't really worry all that much about sex partners getting me pregnant against my will in general. I'm on the pill, so there's not much that my partner can sabotage that would get me pregnant. Though I do worry enough about strangers with date rape drugs that I said "yes" to the second-to-last question.
My reasoning...
With the standard disclaimer that any of these situations are hypothetical and a number of variables could change my answers. My reasoning behind the questions went something like this:
1. In all questions involving rape drugs, the rape part was a worse thing to me than the pregnancy part, and I see rape of myself-as-a-woman as "worse" than rape of myself-as-a-man (though both are bad.) I would get an abortion if I were a woman, and I suspect the courts would be on my side were I the man in that situation.
2. In all the "consensual" questions, worrying about intentional pregnancy was a small issue because sex would not be consensual for me unless it involved proper use of contraceptives and trust of my partner.
As usual, I would very much like to know some of the context behind this poll. :-)
Re: My reasoning...
I personally would not have any confidence at all that the courts would be on your side if that happened to you as a man, unless you happened to have gone directly from waking up from the drugs to the nearest police station and got your blood tested to prove there were rape drugs in your system, in which case you might have a fighting chance. But I base this only on my admittedly unproven presumption that the patriarchal bias in our legal system which puts female rape victims at a disadvantage would not benefit male rape victims by viewing them as men and therefore more believable, but would rather view the fact that they said they had been raped as grounds to consider them less than "real men" and take away any privileges of maleness from them.
In all the consensual questions, "consensual" indicates only that you were consenting to have sex because you had been told that no pregnancy would be involved, and when the pregnancy turned out to be involved, that was not consensual at all.
Re: My reasoning...
As far as your question elsewhere about being raped and becoming pregnant yourself vs. being raped and impregnating followed by suing for child support: as far as i'm concerned, being impregnated is worse than someone impregnating themselves against your will, but rape is bad regardless and when you are using it as a means to essentially steal money from someone until the child support runs out that's pretty bad as well. One thing that must not be forgotten: the child in this case is merely a means to an end (money) and i suspect that there will be a severe lack of love and care in the child's life.
Re: My reasoning...
Re: My reasoning...
I think, however, it is safe to say that the people who are willing to intentionally impregnate themselves and then attempt to extract child support from someone they raped in the process aren't precisely rational.
Secondly, this is one of the reasons concern for the child is warranted...
If someone is trying to make a profit off having children i'm pretty sure some ignoring of the resulting child's basic human needs will take place.
As far as the one in question: again, the story is a bit hearsay- i don't know many of the details and have my own doubts as to the veracity of what i do know. However, the woman in question certainly fit the non-rational model- and that's from my interactions with her, not from hearsay.
Re: My reasoning...
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I just think him then sueing me would be a bit idiotic because if I would discover I'd been raped, I'd go to the police long before there would be any babies.
2: a partner gets you pregnant against your wishes
I can't imagine being a man, and having objections to someone using my sperm. But that is probably because I have the feeling the pregnancy is much much harder on the woman for those 9 months than for the man- he doesn't really feel the consequences, except if the woman expects any money for the baby.
3: no.
I have never heard of a guy deliberately wanting to just impregnate a woman in that situation. Plus I'd be adamant of using protection.
4: no
It really depends on the situation. See above, I can't imagine *minding* much if someone got pregnant off me. But then again, I'm not a man ;)
5: yes
It's just something my parents taught me: always watch your drink, never leave it alone - or when you have to, just get a new one.
6: yes:
see number five.
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I just think him then sueing me would be a bit idiotic because if I would discover I'd been raped, I'd go to the police long before there would be any babies.
But then you'd be a man claiming he was raped. It's rather hard for men to prove they were raped, even harder than it is for women.
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